Go Read This Right Now!

3 10 2008

I mean it!  Hie thee hence!

From JX, a self-described 20-something/male/progressive evangelical/seminary student/minister/musician/gay

Here’s a teaser … READ IT AND GO!

Yesterday I heard two people with whom I work very closely insist that folks “decide” to become gay because it’s a “cool” thing to do. Where the hell is this fairy-tale world that they’re living in??? Because I would love to be there! This is one I haven’t really heard before, but they were absolutely convinced that it happens. Of course, I had to sit there in silence rather than speak up for myself and the many others whose deep pain and frustration is trivialized and mocked by this safe attitude that homosexuality is some sort of “fad,” like crocks or Hannah Montana. I say this is a safe attitude to them, because it depersonalizes the issue and lowers it to a place where one thinks she or he can just tell the person dealing with it to “get over it” and “snap out of it.”  When will people realize how bad this hurts, how NOT cool we think it is, and how dehumanizing it is to speak of gays and lesbians in such terms. Loving our neighbor implies that we should not mock them or trivialize their gravest struggles.

Why is it that secular institutions must consistently lead the way in civil rights and equality? How embarassing, and how utterly impotent as a moral and ethical influence is the community who follows Jesus Christ.



10 responses

3 10 2008

Hie thee hence!

Are you sure you aren’t English?

4 10 2008

Why could you not say something?

4 10 2008
John-Julian, OJN


I remember in the late 1960’s overhearing a multi-sided conversation between six or seven male college students. They were (at least ostensibly) straight, and one said that he had wanted to “try out” a same-sex experience with a gay friend and had actually found it a good experience. A second chimed in that he had “tried it out” when he was 16 and couldn’t see why people thought there was something wrong with it. (“I mean, I wouldn’t trade it for a ‘real f–k’ but it was o.k. — and a lot better than no sex!”) The conclusion was that the rest of the group decided they would “try it out”, too.

And a few months later a gay college friend said he was actually “in demand” by straight guys who wanted to “try it out”.

Of course, that was back in the wild ’60’s!

5 10 2008
Reverend boy

Actually DP, my father’s people are English and came to the US after the Civil War. My mother’s people are Welsh and were colonials going back to pre-1776.

Anthony, I would suggest you ask JX … Follow the link. It’s easy for US to question these folks and challenge them, but sometimes the context of our lives makes us fearful of speaking truth to power.

JJ, always glad to see you and i’m thoroughly enjoying the book you sent me. From what I hear from folks who go to university here in the NYC are still trying it out “just to see what all the fuss is about.” Though I happen to put that more in the category of experimentation than to talk about something like orientation, which speaks to how one is wired.

5 10 2008

I well remember the fear I experienced in the “conservative” church, when closeted, of saying too much that might reveal more about myself than I was prepared for people to know. However, when the time came, I made up for that with a ‘scorched earth” coming out process. When it’s time, it’s time.

JJ, I think there’s a distinction between sexual “experimentation” and being gay. While I can’t imagine it, I do know gay men who have interest in what a sexual encounter with a woman would be like (I stare blankly at them.). But, in my simple mind, to be gay, or bisexual, is to be able to love the same-gendered other, and I don’t think trying sexual experiences on “for size” (No pun intended.), comes close to that.

5 10 2008
Reverend boy

When someone asks me about what it is like “to be gay” I liken it to the ability to fall in love with someone of the same gender as opposed to heterosexuals, who have the ability to fall in love with someone of the composite gender … in other words, straight people do not have the ability to fall in love with someone of the same gender while gay people do not have the ability to fall in love with someone of the composite …

I think THIS resonates more with the universal view about relationships than if we try to confine things to physical and sexual pleasure.

5 10 2008
Larry Shell

Hmmm, Rev Boy… I’m not sure I agree with your last comment. I think I am capable of falling in love with an individual of either gender or even transgendered. My problem would be performing sexually with an individual who doesn’t fit my erotic scheme and so I deliberately refrain from pursuing a relationship with women, for example. Actually, I deliberatly refrain from pursuing relationships with ANYone these days, but that’s beside the point. Emotionally I am drawn to people of both genders, but sexual compatibility rears it’s ugly head (no pun intended).

14 10 2008

Since last Saturday was Coming Out Day, I’ll come out a little bit more explicitly than I have done on my blog.

I am a gay man who in my late thirties fell in love with a straight woman. Liz and Ir have been married for going on thirty nine years. Before that, I was in a relationship with a man for fifteen years — it only ended when Rex died of a heart attack.

For the first few years of my marriage to Liz, I thought that I was bi, but that was really self-deception. I am gay — no doubt about it. These days, and for quite a few years since, I haven’t had sex — of any sort — with anybody. That puts a strain on our relationship, actually nore of a strain for Liz than for me, but its one we can bear.

So I have to say that sexual orientation isn’t about love. It’s about sexual desire — about arousal and attraction. And I mean more than transitory desire or arousal and more than performance.

14 10 2008
Larry Shell

Allen, thanks for sharing. I have often puzzled about forming a relationship with women. Every now and then I come across a gal who “makes me wonder if I’m missing something” – that’s the expression I use. I never act on the attraction for many reasons, fear of being an inadequate lover, fear of how my straight women friends would feel when I walked in with a girlfriend, the confusion on the part of my family…I thought maybe I was a bit screwy.

Revboy, don’t get me wrong, I am so attracted to guys – but a lot of guys don’t seem to value what I value. In fact, I’ve often said that if I transgendered I would probably end up a lesbian – tell me that isn’t bizarre!

Allen, I have a couple that I am very good friends with and the former husband transgendered male to female at about age 60. This was only in the a few years ago. The wife has stayed put because they love each other. I have no idea if their is any sexual intimacy – I think not – however, given that she had gone through some major prostate cancer treatment before gender realligning, that may already have been set aside.

Revboy – why no recent posts or comments? I’ve been waiting to hear more from you. Is all the market volatility keeping you too busy?

Peace all

28 10 2008

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I created this blog about that subject:
in http://tinyurl.com/65dptv

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